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Post by catamount87 on Jan 11, 2019 16:14:05 GMT -5
Y'all continue to want to rail on "the white building" that those within. The real funding problems for WCU are 300 miles away and in the hands of boys and girls more interested in espousing their belief that taxes are bad, government spending is rampantly out of control, gaining political favor, getting re-elected, serving themselves and cementing political dominance for their viewpoints. What happens at a smallish regional university 300 miles away is no concern of theirs other than making sure they send only the barest minimum level of funds for said smallish regional university 300 miles away to operate. Look no further than the monumental effort Dr Belcher et al had to make to get funding to replace a failing, nearly 100 year old steam plant with boilers nearly 75 years old. So quit your b*&^ing about the white building and take up the funding issues with YOUR NC General Assembly members! Education is the foundation for every society, region, state and community to grow and to realize their potential! The NC General Assembly just doesn't get that fact, so help them get it! You are totally full-of-bull on this one. All you want to do is rail on the state legislature, like the good Democrat you are. The state has nothing to do with WCU's athletics problems. ASU, EZU, NC State, Carolina and others have all thrived under the same folks in Raleigh. I guess by your thoughts, the folks in Raleigh have it out for Cullowhee? You folks want to blame everything on Republicans, even the crappy state of athletics in Cullowhee. The problem is and has always been the folks in the administration building right on the campus of Western Carolina, the chancellor and his/her staff. Get a life, open your eyes and put the responsibility where it belongs. Oh yeah, it's Trump's fault, right? Sorry to break the news to you but I am a life long republican. I grew up in a republican household and more often than not vote for republicans. As for my rant about the NCGA, anyone who denies that they don't protect their own is in denial. Another fact, without a doubt the lobbying power, direct and indirect, that the larger institutions have shows in the state budget year after year. Our lobbying power, political influence and political patronage in Raleigh pales in comparison to UNC, NCSU, ECU, App and UNCC. I'll say it again, look no further than the monumental effort it took just to get the steam plant replaced. Now tell me would UNC, NCSU, App, ECU or UNCC have to go to those lengths? Most definitely they wouldn't! The bucks start in Raleigh where the decisions are made to where to send those bucks. As it has been for a long, long time, sending those bucks west isn't a high priority.
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Post by wcu72 on Jan 11, 2019 16:39:02 GMT -5
You are totally full-of-bull on this one. All you want to do is rail on the state legislature, like the good Democrat you are. The state has nothing to do with WCU's athletics problems. ASU, EZU, NC State, Carolina and others have all thrived under the same folks in Raleigh. I guess by your thoughts, the folks in Raleigh have it out for Cullowhee? You folks want to blame everything on Republicans, even the crappy state of athletics in Cullowhee. The problem is and has always been the folks in the administration building right on the campus of Western Carolina, the chancellor and his/her staff. Get a life, open your eyes and put the responsibility where it belongs. Oh yeah, it's Trump's fault, right? Sorry to break the news to you but I am a life long republican. I grew up in a republican household and more often than not vote for republicans. As for my rant about the NCGA, anyone who denies that they don't protect their own is in denial. Another fact, without a doubt the lobbying power, direct and indirect, that the larger institutions have shows in the state budget year after year. Our lobbying power, political influence and political patronage in Raleigh pales in comparison to UNC, NCSU, ECU, App and UNCC. I'll say it again, look no further than the monumental effort it took just to get the steam plant replaced. Now tell me would UNC, NCSU, App, ECU or UNCC have to go to those lengths? Most definitely they wouldn't! The bucks start in Raleigh where the decisions are made to where to send those bucks. As it has been for a long, long time, sending those bucks west isn't a high priority. Oh no, I just found out Raleigh hates us in Cullowhee. That's why our athletics programs finish bottom of the barrel in the SoCon, especially the football team. Woo is me. It has nothing to do with our past chancellors' lack of support for athletics, athletic directors that just plain didn't know what they were doing, or the unfortunate choices made in head coaches, it can all be blamed on the legislatures in Raleigh. But of course, those Republicans in Raleigh love Appalachian State, that's why they are now FBS, and have 19k students, and a football stadium that will seat 30k, it had nothing to do with their past chancellors, or ADs or head coaches. Woo is me, it all those Republican's fault in the state legislature. PS, I was raised in a household of hard-core Democrats, that means nothing about how I vote.
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Post by catamount87 on Jan 11, 2019 21:47:42 GMT -5
Good grief you have SO MISSED MY POINT.
"Our lobbying power, political influence and political patronage in Raleigh pales in comparison to UNC, NCSU, ECU, App and UNCC. "
Along get GA members buying into the idea that WCU is worthy of their support and investment, that it's a place that "their" money is well spent, get them to buy in and be long term supporters.
Change that and then the purse strings will allow more funds to fly west.
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Post by FLCATAMOUNT on Jan 11, 2019 22:48:00 GMT -5
Sorry to break the news to you but I am a life long republican. I grew up in a republican household and more often than not vote for republicans. As for my rant about the NCGA, anyone who denies that they don't protect their own is in denial. Another fact, without a doubt the lobbying power, direct and indirect, that the larger institutions have shows in the state budget year after year. Our lobbying power, political influence and political patronage in Raleigh pales in comparison to UNC, NCSU, ECU, App and UNCC. I'll say it again, look no further than the monumental effort it took just to get the steam plant replaced. Now tell me would UNC, NCSU, App, ECU or UNCC have to go to those lengths? Most definitely they wouldn't! The bucks start in Raleigh where the decisions are made to where to send those bucks. As it has been for a long, long time, sending those bucks west isn't a high priority. Oh no, I just found out Raleigh hates us in Cullowhee. That's why our athletics programs finish bottom of the barrel in the SoCon, especially the football team. Woo is me. It has nothing to do with our past chancellors' lack of support for athletics, athletic directors that just plain didn't know what they were doing, or the unfortunate choices made in head coaches, it can all be blamed on the legislatures in Raleigh. But of course, those Republicans in Raleigh love Appalachian State, that's why they are now FBS, and have 19k students, and a football stadium that will seat 30k, it had nothing to do with their past chancellors, or ADs or head coaches. Woo is me, it all those Republican's fault in the state legislature. PS, I was raised in a household of hard-core Democrats, that means nothing about how I vote. 72, You and Jim are spot on about this. 87 has always made excuses for all past and present administrations. I used to think that he had a hidden agenda and was trying to gain favor with the powers that be in Cullowhee. I now believe that he actually believes that the problem does not lie with the folks in charge of the university as illogical as that belief is. Since Belcher took over, the folks in the white building have continued to cut the amount of money allocated to athletics as Catamount Club giving has tripled leaving funding for athletics at the overall level of funding in 2011. Those are choices made by the people in charge plain and simple. It is indefensible for the Catamount Club to ask for more money and at the same time the Chancellor reduces what the university funds to keep athletic funding at the same level. It is disingenuous at best and criminal at worst.
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Post by catamount87 on Jan 12, 2019 9:49:06 GMT -5
No, I never said I didn't hold the administration, past and present, to some fault. They definitely shoulder part of the blame. But there's plenty of blame to go around.
Throughout this discussion many folks are making a HUGE ASSUMPTION, that the university's budget remained the same over the last 8-10 years.
Unfortunately, the NCGA cut the UNC system budget multiple times over that time period which forced everyone to make hard and difficult decisions about how to balance the budget. As a percentage, the NCGA's cuts to WCU's budget over this time period have been close to the largest cuts seen in the UNC system. WCU was already just above shoestring budget status. Our less than ideal political influence made us a ripe target for larger percentage cuts when cuts were made and an easy place to forget when paltry additions were made.
Y'all want to dismiss just how big of an impact politics plays in this equation. Go right ahead because it's you who have your heads in the sand. I'll leave y'all to the blame game conversation now.
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Post by WesternFan on Jan 12, 2019 10:07:05 GMT -5
No, I never said I didn't hold the administration, past and present, to some fault. They definitely shoulder part of the blame. But there's plenty of blame to go around. Throughout this discussion many folks are making a HUGE ASSUMPTION, that the university's budget remained the same over the last 8-10 years. Unfortunately, the NCGA cut the UNC system budget multiple times over that time period which forced everyone to make hard and difficult decisions about how to balance the budget. As a percentage, the NCGA's cuts to WCU's budget over this time period have been close to the largest cuts seen in the UNC system. WCU was already just above shoestring budget status. Our less than ideal political influence made us a ripe target for larger percentage cuts when cuts were made and an easy place to forget when paltry additions were made. Y'all want to dismiss just how big of an impact politics plays in this equation. Go right ahead because it's you who have your heads in the sand. I'll leave y'all to the blame game conversation now. I can tell you a few things that will happen this upcoming season unless Speir pulls the rabbit out of the hat and wins 8 or 9 games this year: a. Catamount Club giving takes a substantial dip this year, due to poor win/loss record, lack of faith in coaching staff that anything will change and like of faith in the leadership of the university's commitment to athletics b. Season ticket sales take a hit, c. Attendance at games also takes a dip. d. Recruiting becomes even more difficult in Cullowhee, as student-athletics want to attend schools that win
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Post by FLCATAMOUNT on Jan 13, 2019 9:57:09 GMT -5
No, I never said I didn't hold the administration, past and present, to some fault. They definitely shoulder part of the blame. But there's plenty of blame to go around. Throughout this discussion many folks are making a HUGE ASSUMPTION, that the university's budget remained the same over the last 8-10 years. Unfortunately, the NCGA cut the UNC system budget multiple times over that time period which forced everyone to make hard and difficult decisions about how to balance the budget. As a percentage, the NCGA's cuts to WCU's budget over this time period have been close to the largest cuts seen in the UNC system. WCU was already just above shoestring budget status. Our less than ideal political influence made us a ripe target for larger percentage cuts when cuts were made and an easy place to forget when paltry additions were made. Y'all want to dismiss just how big of an impact politics plays in this equation. Go right ahead because it's you who have your heads in the sand. I'll leave y'all to the blame game conversation now. Agree that the budget has taken a hit from the state. It comes down to choices. I do know that Chancellor Belcher protected 6 areas from cuts and one of those was not athletics. I do know that one of the areas that saw an increase was the arts. Belcher said that on multiple occasions. In my opinion, winning sports teams are more important than the arts. You and I can disagree on that, but we should have known what would happen when we hired a piano virtuoso to be our Chancellor. I know you disagree with me, but I will state it again, and your argument supports my hypothesis. Athletics and especially football is not a priority at Western Carolina. I know the budget was cut, but athletics was not protected from the cuts by the administration like the 6 areas that Chancellor Belcher stated were protected. So all the BS about athletics being the front porch of the University is nothing more than a lie. We can also disagree that when the public wants to fund athletics more through donations to the Catamount Club. My position is that is nothing more than bate and switch or a ponzi scheme and is unfair to the folks who spend their hard earn money to improve athletics and the university chooses to basically take money from athletics to fund the other "more important" areas like the arts. If an alumni wants to give money to athletics, all of that money, plus what the university has contributed for athletics should be for athletics. Period. No Chancellor or BOT should be able to siphon funds from Athletics to fund their so called more important areas just because they can't manage the budget cuts from the state. We will have to disagree on a moral point of what is right or wrong and the administration should be ashamed in my opinion. Chancellor Belcher violated the implied contract between Athletic Contributors and the University by cutting the budget by the same amount contributed to Western Carolina Athletics. If I give $1200 dollars to the Catamount Club and the Chancellor cuts the university apportionment to Athletics by $1,200 and then protects the arts and increases their budget, then I just gave $1,200 to the arts which I do not want to fund. It is NOT the Chancellors decision to do with the money as he sees fit and violates a trust. It might be legal, but it is immoral.
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