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Post by wcuecu2010 on Jan 16, 2019 3:57:06 GMT -5
No not all G5 schools that made 3 crap bowls in that time frame. Some teams with horrid records prior to a coach that started winning and having decent mediocre seasons and that coach would be loved and given a lifetime contract per se. Also, here is a P5 school for you. What about David Cutcliffe at Duke. He took over a horrid Duke program and has had some good seasons, and bad seasons and more mediocre seasons. Yet, they love him in Durham and happy making bowls with 6-6 records and even for a P5 program those bowls are often crappy. Point is Speir has taken us places we have not been consistently since Waters, Speir has become a victim of his own success. At least your upset he has not won the conference or made the playoffs yet that means expectations are higher than before he arrived. Lets see how the season pans out, if he wins 3 games or less I may think its time too with the talent he has now and experience but I want to be realistic and not have too much high expectations yet. We are not North Dakota St yet. I'm sorry, but most of your post makes no sense. However, I did understand you saying Speir has taken us places we have not been consistently since Waters. I beg to differ, a 3-7 or 3-8 winning season record is not consistently winning, it's consistently losing. So the one thing Speir has done consistently is loose, and we've consistently lost since Waters. It would be nice if you made some valid arguments, rather than just saying we need to keep Speir. Not sure what you have against him or what Speir has done to you but in the last 5 years, we have had 3 winning seasons, almost made playoffs in 2017. Last year was disappointing but we were very young and green on defense and we should have at least won 3 more games last year. Many plays were correctly called but our players turned it over a number of times on the 1 yard line or red zone. So that is not the coaches fault. So yes my comments make sense, although your not liking my response because I am Pro-Speir and I see a foundation being built. It is just many expect too much too soon. But if you think we can sway Dabo Sweeney away from Clemson thats not happening either. Have you considered talking to Eaton about how you think you could do a better job as HC? Please let him know and when we make the playoffs, I will be the first to support a statue of you being erected at Whitmire. Until then unite and support the program and the coach. It is only a matter of time. Again if we only win 0-3 games in 2019 ill be more in agreement with you, 5 wins and he should get an extra year, finish .500 or better yes I agree with a whole new contract with multiple years. Honestly, if next year we finish 7-5 or 8-4 and somehow make the playoffs as a 2nd place team, many will complain Speir can not win the SoCon, News flash neither did Waters in our NC runner-up year, or if we lost in the 1st round to say a Kennesaw St, many would go bat crap looney over losing to KSU and want him gone cuz he lost to them. Some on here never wanted him and have looked for excuses day 1. Some hold the fact of his Appalachian State ties against him. Look I want to see us successful too, but I disagree with the reactionary method of firing Speir when Speir does not meet many of the Lunatic Fringe's demanding and unrealistic expectations of undefeated season, beating Alabama, and NC State; and winning the National Championship. Hopefully, many of you do not expect us to beat Alabama next year, we are not Clemson. I could see it now. We get beat 63-7 at Alabama and it will be "OMG Speir cant beat Alabama, Speir must be fired." May be far-fetched but that is how it seems. I make no appologies for my strong support of Coach Speir and Randy Eaton, they are doing the best they can trying to make lemonade with a a shortage of lemons. We are in good hands. You have been patient for how long? Just a little more patience and us Catamounts are getting ready to reap the rewards. Go Cats and Fear the Speir!!! |
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Post by WesternFan on Jan 16, 2019 10:46:01 GMT -5
I'm sorry, but most of your post makes no sense. However, I did understand you saying Speir has taken us places we have not been consistently since Waters. I beg to differ, a 3-7 or 3-8 winning season record is not consistently winning, it's consistently losing. So the one thing Speir has done consistently is loose, and we've consistently lost since Waters. It would be nice if you made some valid arguments, rather than just saying we need to keep Speir. Not sure what you have against him or what Speir has done to you but in the last 5 years, we have had 3 winning seasons, almost made playoffs in 2017. Last year was disappointing but we were very young and green on defense and we should have at least won 3 more games last year. Many plays were correctly called but our players turned it over a number of times on the 1 yard line or red zone. So that is not the coaches fault. So yes my comments make sense, although your not liking my response because I am Pro-Speir and I see a foundation being built. It is just many expect too much too soon. But if you think we can sway Dabo Sweeney away from Clemson thats not happening either. Have you considered talking to Eaton about how you think you could do a better job as HC? Please let him know and when we make the playoffs, I will be the first to support a statue of you being erected at Whitmire. Until then unite and support the program and the coach. It is only a matter of time. Again if we only win 0-3 games in 2019 ill be more in agreement with you, 5 wins and he should get an extra year, finish .500 or better yes I agree with a whole new contract with multiple years. Honestly, if next year we finish 7-5 or 8-4 and somehow make the playoffs as a 2nd place team, many will complain Speir can not win the SoCon, News flash neither did Waters in our NC runner-up year, or if we lost in the 1st round to say a Kennesaw St, many would go bat crap looney over losing to KSU and want him gone cuz he lost to them. Some on here never wanted him and have looked for excuses day 1. Some hold the fact of his Appalachian State ties against him. Look I want to see us successful too, but I disagree with the reactionary method of firing Speir when Speir does not meet many of the Lunatic Fringe's demanding and unrealistic expectations of undefeated season, beating Alabama, and NC State; and winning the National Championship. Hopefully, many of you do not expect us to beat Alabama next year, we are not Clemson. I could see it now. We get beat 63-7 at Alabama and it will be "OMG Speir cant beat Alabama, Speir must be fired." May be far-fetched but that is how it seems. I make no appologies for my strong support of Coach Speir and Randy Eaton, they are doing the best they can trying to make lemonade with a a shortage of lemons. We are in good hands. You have been patient for how long? Just a little more patience and us Catamounts are getting ready to reap the rewards. Go Cats and Fear the Speir!!! We've got an overall football history as a looser program due to attitudes such as yours. Many Catamount fans profess to want championships but are perfectly willing to accept mediocrity in their coaches. If you don't demand performance, you won't get it. Say what else you want, I'm done on this topic |
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Post by catalumn08 on Jan 16, 2019 10:48:52 GMT -5
Kudos to Speir for taking us out of the basement of FCS football. I think he's reached his ceiling, it's time to find the guy that can get us to the next level. It's not coach Speir. We are one 3-8 season away from being back to that lowly place we were at for so many years.
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Post by jim64 on Jan 16, 2019 13:22:14 GMT -5
I'm sorry, but most of your post makes no sense. However, I did understand you saying Speir has taken us places we have not been consistently since Waters. I beg to differ, a 3-7 or 3-8 winning season record is not consistently winning, it's consistently losing. So the one thing Speir has done consistently is loose, and we've consistently lost since Waters. It would be nice if you made some valid arguments, rather than just saying we need to keep Speir. Not sure what you have against him or what Speir has done to you but in the last 5 years, we have had 3 winning seasons, almost made playoffs in 2017. Last year was disappointing but we were very young and green on defense and we should have at least won 3 more games last year. Many plays were correctly called but our players turned it over a number of times on the 1 yard line or red zone. So that is not the coaches fault. So yes my comments make sense, although your not liking my response because I am Pro-Speir and I see a foundation being built. It is just many expect too much too soon. But if you think we can sway Dabo Sweeney away from Clemson thats not happening either. Have you considered talking to Eaton about how you think you could do a better job as HC? Please let him know and when we make the playoffs, I will be the first to support a statue of you being erected at Whitmire. Until then unite and support the program and the coach. It is only a matter of time. Again if we only win 0-3 games in 2019 ill be more in agreement with you, 5 wins and he should get an extra year, finish .500 or better yes I agree with a whole new contract with multiple years. Honestly, if next year we finish 7-5 or 8-4 and somehow make the playoffs as a 2nd place team, many will complain Speir can not win the SoCon, News flash neither did Waters in our NC runner-up year, or if we lost in the 1st round to say a Kennesaw St, many would go bat crap looney over losing to KSU and want him gone cuz he lost to them. Some on here never wanted him and have looked for excuses day 1. Some hold the fact of his Appalachian State ties against him. Look I want to see us successful too, but I disagree with the reactionary method of firing Speir when Speir does not meet many of the Lunatic Fringe's demanding and unrealistic expectations of undefeated season, beating Alabama, and NC State; and winning the National Championship. Hopefully, many of you do not expect us to beat Alabama next year, we are not Clemson. I could see it now. We get beat 63-7 at Alabama and it will be "OMG Speir cant beat Alabama, Speir must be fired." May be far-fetched but that is how it seems. I make no appologies for my strong support of Coach Speir and Randy Eaton, they are doing the best they can trying to make lemonade with a a shortage of lemons. We are in good hands. You have been patient for how long? Just a little more patience and us Catamounts are getting ready to reap the rewards. Go Cats and Fear the Speir!!! If you had a Football Program that was in the toilet & there were no signs of improvement, what type of Coach would you hire to right the ship? Just for your info, Coach Waters is the only Coach in WCU Football History to go undefeated in the SoCon during a regular season & beat the regular season champions. Now, for Coaching Qualifications, Coach Speir was an Assistant Defensive Coach at App State working for Coach Wiley. He had NO PRIOR COACHING EXPERIENCE AS A DEFENSIVE COORDINATOR OR AS AN OFFENSIVE COORDINATOR. He also had NO PRIOR EXPERIENCE AS A HEAD FOOTBALL COACH AT ANY LEVEL. To my knowledge, he did not play football at the collegiate level and I’m not sure about the High School Level. Eaton must have been infatuated with the fact that Coach Speir was a Coach at App State & that TRUMPED all his negatives that would have normally disqualified him as a candidate. I have been open about my concerns with Coach Speir’s Qualifications from day one. I have seen nothing he has done on the Football Field that has caused me to change my opinion. Eaton was also hired with no previous experience as an AD at any level. Belcher was directly or indirectly involved with hiring these men & at the same time he was sticking it to the Catamount Club & shifting Coaching Salaries to the Athletic Department. Now with that said, 2010 do you see why some people on this Board are very skeptical about Eaton’s & Speir’s ability to take the Football Program to the next level. One more comment, defense wins Conference Championships & Offense sales ticket. A good head coach would know that a good defense is a priority when it comes to turning a poor Football Program around. Coach Speir is the Poster Boy for this observation. He has had teams that were at the top of the Offensive Stats in the SoCon & ranked near the Bottom in Defensive Stats. During the past 7 years, the WCU Football Teams have stayed at home during the post season playoffs & you get the same excuses to justify why we just need more time. I think the perfect example to debunk this mindset is the ETSU Football Program. Randy Sanders was hired & his first year as Head Coach their team tied for the SoCon Championship & a playoff appearance. By the way, Coach Sanders applied for the Head Coaching Job at WCU during the Bardo Administration & was not hired. |
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Post by LCACAT on Jan 16, 2019 13:27:42 GMT -5
Not sure what you have against him or what Speir has done to you but in the last 5 years, we have had 3 winning seasons, almost made playoffs in 2017. Last year was disappointing but we were very young and green on defense and we should have at least won 3 more games last year. Many plays were correctly called but our players turned it over a number of times on the 1 yard line or red zone. So that is not the coaches fault. So yes my comments make sense, although your not liking my response because I am Pro-Speir and I see a foundation being built. It is just many expect too much too soon. But if you think we can sway Dabo Sweeney away from Clemson thats not happening either. Have you considered talking to Eaton about how you think you could do a better job as HC? Please let him know and when we make the playoffs, I will be the first to support a statue of you being erected at Whitmire. Until then unite and support the program and the coach. It is only a matter of time. Again if we only win 0-3 games in 2019 ill be more in agreement with you, 5 wins and he should get an extra year, finish .500 or better yes I agree with a whole new contract with multiple years. Honestly, if next year we finish 7-5 or 8-4 and somehow make the playoffs as a 2nd place team, many will complain Speir can not win the SoCon, News flash neither did Waters in our NC runner-up year, or if we lost in the 1st round to say a Kennesaw St, many would go bat crap looney over losing to KSU and want him gone cuz he lost to them. Some on here never wanted him and have looked for excuses day 1. Some hold the fact of his Appalachian State ties against him. Look I want to see us successful too, but I disagree with the reactionary method of firing Speir when Speir does not meet many of the Lunatic Fringe's demanding and unrealistic expectations of undefeated season, beating Alabama, and NC State; and winning the National Championship. Hopefully, many of you do not expect us to beat Alabama next year, we are not Clemson. I could see it now. We get beat 63-7 at Alabama and it will be "OMG Speir cant beat Alabama, Speir must be fired." May be far-fetched but that is how it seems. I make no appologies for my strong support of Coach Speir and Randy Eaton, they are doing the best they can trying to make lemonade with a a shortage of lemons. We are in good hands. You have been patient for how long? Just a little more patience and us Catamounts are getting ready to reap the rewards. Go Cats and Fear the Speir!!! If you had a Football Program that was in the toilet & there were no signs of improvement, what type of Coach would you hire to right the ship? Just for your info, Coach Waters is the only Coach in WCU Football History to go undefeated in the SoCon during a regular season & beat the regular season champions. Now, for Coaching Qualifications, Coach Speir was an Assistant Defensive Coach at App State working for Coach Wiley. He had NO PRIOR COACHING EXPERIENCE AS A DEFENSIVE COORDINATOR OR AS AN OFFENSIVE COORDINATOR. He also had NO PRIOR EXPERIENCE AS A HEAD FOOTBALL COACH AT ANY LEVEL. To my knowledge, he did not play football at the collegiate level and I’m not sure about the High School Level. Eaton must have been infatuated with the fact that Coach Speir was a Coach at App State & that TRUMPED all his negatives that would have normally disqualified him as a candidate. I have been open about my concerns with Coach Speir’s Qualifications from day one. I have seen nothing he has done on the Football Field that has caused me to change my opinion. Eaton was also hired with no previous experience as an AD at any level. Belcher was directly or indirectly involved with hiring these men & at the same time he was sticking it to the Catamount Club & shifting Coaching Salaries to the Athletic Department. Now with that said, 2010 do you see why some people on this Board are very skeptical about Eaton’s & Speir’s ability to take the Football Program to the next level. One more comment, defense wins Conference Championships & Offense sales ticket. A good head coach would know that a good defense is a priority when it comes to turning a poor Football Program around. Coach Speir is the Poster Boy for this observation. He has had teams that were at the top of the Offensive Stats in the SoCon & ranked near the Bottom in Defensive Stats. During the past 7 years, the WCU Football Teams have stayed at home during the post season playoffs & you get the same excuses to justify why we just need more time. I think the perfect example to debunk this mindset is the ETSU Football Program. Randy Sanders was hired & his first year as Head Coach their team tied for the SoCon Championship & a playoff appearance. By the way, Coach Sanders applied for the Head Coaching Job at WCU during the Bardo Administration & was not hired. |
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Post by LCACAT on Jan 16, 2019 13:31:28 GMT -5
Just so you are aware Dabo Sweeny had no experience as either an OC or DC, he was a Wide Receiver Postion Coach when he was elevated to Head Coach, he was a walk on WR at Alabama, but to your other point that Mark did not play college football (he did play on some very good Kannapolis A L Brown teams) neither did Paul Johnson play football while at WCU. So those 2 points have no value in your statement.
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Post by jim64 on Jan 16, 2019 14:39:02 GMT -5
Just so you are aware Dabo Sweeny had no experience as either an OC or DC, he was a Wide Receiver Postion Coach when he was elevated to Head Coach, he was a walk on WR at Alabama, but to your other point that Mark did not play college football (he did play on some very good Kannapolis A L Brown teams) neither did Paul Johnson play football while at WCU. So those 2 points have no value in your statement. Dabo was an Assistant Head Coach at Clemson prior to becoming Head Coach at Clemson. Dabo was an Intrim Head Coach at Clemson for about half a season before becoming HC.That is true about Paul Johnson. However, he was an Offensive Coordinator at three different schools prior to becoming a Head Coach. Mr Speir had no experience other than being an Assistant Coach. Coach Sweeny & Coach Johnson are exceptional coaches & have done well. If you are trying to parallel their careers with Coach Speir’s career, you are dreaming. Coach Speir is not a Coach Sweeny or a Coach Johnson. If my memory is correct, Coach Johnson developed the option offense that Ga Southern ran while he was the OC prior to becoming the HC. Coach Johnson & Coach Sweeny are exceptions to the normal progression to being a HC. At this point in time, I have seen nothing that would have put Coach Speir in that “Exceptional Class” that Paul Johnson or Dabo Sweeny have achieved in the Coaching Profession. I personally like Coach Speir but I never thought he had the background to reverse a terrible Football Program. Again, that is just my opinion on Coach Speir’s Resume prior to becoming HC at Western. I would love to hear 72’s remarks on this. |
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Post by SCCat66 on Jan 16, 2019 14:40:18 GMT -5
Just so you are aware Dabo Sweeny had no experience as either an OC or DC, he was a Wide Receiver Postion Coach when he was elevated to Head Coach, he was a walk on WR at Alabama, but to your other point that Mark did not play college football (he did play on some very good Kannapolis A L Brown teams) neither did Paul Johnson play football while at WCU. So those 2 points have no value in your statement. Coach Speir walked on at Clemson after playing at A.L. Brown High in Kannapolis. He realized fairly early on that he did not have the physical tools (and size) to compete for a scholarship at Clemson. So he served as a Manager and Hey-Boy for the next 3 years. Washed towels and jocks, pumped up footballs, etc. with the idea that he wanted to get into coaching. Steve Hodgin gave him a GA slot at Western and then kept him on the staff as an Asst. Coach for 4 years after he got his Masters Degree. Mark Speir WANTS to be in Cullowhee. He is loyal to the place. He is trying to build a program on a solid foundation that will have staying power. He is not trying any quick-fix stuff by bringing in a bus-load of JUCO's. I'm sure no one was more disappointed and frustrated at the regression of the 2018 team than he was. With a senior-laden OL and a 3rd year QB, there was no way we should have won only 3 games !! But it happened... Let's see what kind of rebound the team (and coaches) can make in 2019. And then we will know if a contract extension is justified. |
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Post by newfoundcat on Jan 16, 2019 15:28:31 GMT -5
Thank you SCcat! I believe that is about all that needs to be said right now.
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Post by wcuecu2010 on Jan 16, 2019 16:14:09 GMT -5
Just so you are aware Dabo Sweeny had no experience as either an OC or DC, he was a Wide Receiver Postion Coach when he was elevated to Head Coach, he was a walk on WR at Alabama, but to your other point that Mark did not play college football (he did play on some very good Kannapolis A L Brown teams) neither did Paul Johnson play football while at WCU. So those 2 points have no value in your statement. Coach Speir walked on at Clemson after playing at A.L. Brown High in Kannapolis. He realized fairly early on that he did not have the physical tools (and size) to compete for a scholarship at Clemson. So he served as a Manager and Hey-Boy for the next 3 years. Washed towels and jocks, pumped up footballs, etc. with the idea that he wanted to get into coaching. Steve Hodgin gave him a GA slot at Western and then kept him on the staff as an Asst. Coach for 4 years after he got his Masters Degree. Mark Speir WANTS to be in Cullowhee. He is loyal to the place. He is trying to build a program on a solid foundation that will have staying power. He is not trying any quick-fix stuff by bringing in a bus-load of JUCO's. I'm sure no one was more disappointed and frustrated at the regression of the 2018 team than he was. With a senior-laden OL and a 3rd year QB, there was no way we should have won only 3 games !! But it happened... Let's see what kind of rebound the team (and coaches) can make in 2019. And then we will know if a contract extension is justified. 100% in aggreance... Lets see how the season plays out first. Go Cats!!! |
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